New Lake protocol mapping
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Nick Tabor
New Lake protocol mapping
When going to fish a new lake, what would be the process for most spoonpluggers, look at a map, identify certain structure, go find it and map it to see if it goes all the way or would you go to the deepest area on the map and check it out for structure leading to it. This would be assuming its summer patterns and water color is the same in the entire lake. I realize both would work but which one is more appropriate.
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John Bales
- JB2
- Posts: 2478
- Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:51 pm
New lake
This is what a person should do. Study your map, pick out the best structures(seasonally and daily), drive around the lake if you want to check for the best color, put the boat in at an area that wont take all day to get to the fishing waters..... Begin with a 500 and head in the direction of a feature you want to check. Go a while and check your speeds along the way. Then go to a 400 and do the same thing and then a 250. Do not go any deeper unless you see something that deserves some time. Many things can be learned by starting out right from tha launch including some of the best fishing waters. By the time that you get to your fishing waters you will have learned a bit about the lake and if any fish are moving. This is definately what Mr. Perry would do. John
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Fran Myers
- JB1
- Posts: 1289
- Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 10:08 am
- Location: St. Paul, MN
Mapping
John,
I recently came in possession of some of the old "Fishing Facts" magizine articles. I think I may not be understanding something correctly.
In one of them, Buck says to start with the 500 and go some distance. Then if no movement is detected, go to the 400 move to deeper water and continue on without backtracking.
Did I understand this correctly?
Fran
I recently came in possession of some of the old "Fishing Facts" magizine articles. I think I may not be understanding something correctly.
In one of them, Buck says to start with the 500 and go some distance. Then if no movement is detected, go to the 400 move to deeper water and continue on without backtracking.
Did I understand this correctly?
Fran
Fran Myers
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WMK
Nick,
The approach a spoonplugger would/should take in a preliminary assessment of existing structure situations would hinge solely on his level of mapping experience. Someone with advanced mapping/interpretation skills would run pattern passes (probably no more than 2) and come up with a fair assessment as to a structure's potential. This exercise could take only a few minutes. On the other hand, if a spoonplugger with lessor experience were working out a lake, he'd first have to learn how to identify structure by utilizing more markers, so as to outline existing features, before expecting to make any degree of interpretation, with confidence. And in both cases, the final interpretation would come from executing proper depth & speed control.
Fran,
Review "Presentation of Lures" Vol. 5 of the "Home Study Series". What you're looking for is on p. 63, bottom portion, and continuing ...
Walt
The approach a spoonplugger would/should take in a preliminary assessment of existing structure situations would hinge solely on his level of mapping experience. Someone with advanced mapping/interpretation skills would run pattern passes (probably no more than 2) and come up with a fair assessment as to a structure's potential. This exercise could take only a few minutes. On the other hand, if a spoonplugger with lessor experience were working out a lake, he'd first have to learn how to identify structure by utilizing more markers, so as to outline existing features, before expecting to make any degree of interpretation, with confidence. And in both cases, the final interpretation would come from executing proper depth & speed control.
Fran,
Review "Presentation of Lures" Vol. 5 of the "Home Study Series". What you're looking for is on p. 63, bottom portion, and continuing ...
Walt
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Nick
John and Walt,
Thanks for the replies, John what you explained helps me to get a general Idea as to how to start. Walt, I still dont really have a feel what you think is more important, structure on a map to check out first or deepest water areas.
Am I dwelling on this too much? I am trying to save as much time prior to getting on the water and putting too much time into trolling waters.
Thanks for the replies, John what you explained helps me to get a general Idea as to how to start. Walt, I still dont really have a feel what you think is more important, structure on a map to check out first or deepest water areas.
Am I dwelling on this too much? I am trying to save as much time prior to getting on the water and putting too much time into trolling waters.
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Guest
Nick,
You can never be too focused on approaches to mapping, but you may be splitting hairs here. Both methods i.e. deepest water/ structure selection will eventually yield proper interpretation.
But to be address your question in more specific terms, I'd suggest that looking for the deepest water in the area first, then pondering related features would be the way to go.
Remember what Buck sez - when interpreting a map, especially with respect to reservoirs, start from the deepest water, then take note of deeper contour lines that suggest breaks (sharper) leading to a feature. And we reverse that process as we begin our presentation of lures. Hope that clarifies things a bit better.
Walt
You can never be too focused on approaches to mapping, but you may be splitting hairs here. Both methods i.e. deepest water/ structure selection will eventually yield proper interpretation.
But to be address your question in more specific terms, I'd suggest that looking for the deepest water in the area first, then pondering related features would be the way to go.
Remember what Buck sez - when interpreting a map, especially with respect to reservoirs, start from the deepest water, then take note of deeper contour lines that suggest breaks (sharper) leading to a feature. And we reverse that process as we begin our presentation of lures. Hope that clarifies things a bit better.
Walt
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Nick Tabor
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John Bales
- JB2
- Posts: 2478
- Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:51 pm
New water
The 500 is run for a distance(two to four feet0 and then the 400 (4 to 6) and then the 250(6-9) but by no means check any deeper while doing this unless you see that something is there. You asked how do I start out fishing a new lake. This is how you do it,. Your interpretation of a lake always starts in the deepest water(a hole or a channel) but in fishing a new lake you always start out in the shallows and work your way out. John
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WMK
Nick,
The study material you're seeking is in Vol. 1 of Mapping & Interpretation. Specfically reference p. 31. The whole page focuses on interpreting a map, especially topo maps of reservoirs. Take special note at the top of this page, how Buck instructs a fisherman to seek out more gradual breaking features first, as structures on these lake types can often break sharper than anticipated, at least from a viewpoint of map-study only.
Walt
The study material you're seeking is in Vol. 1 of Mapping & Interpretation. Specfically reference p. 31. The whole page focuses on interpreting a map, especially topo maps of reservoirs. Take special note at the top of this page, how Buck instructs a fisherman to seek out more gradual breaking features first, as structures on these lake types can often break sharper than anticipated, at least from a viewpoint of map-study only.
Walt
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Nick Tabor
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pat maio
Nick.
You pose a good question. One that I've never been entirely certain what the answer is.
From the study material, as I understood it, controur trolling should end after using the first three sizes, yet...
while I attended the s/p course in Minaki, Ontario about 20 years ago I was surprised that in their specially prepared material and structure situations there was a few that called for contour trolling going as deep as necessary with the other size spoonplugs.
Perhaps one of the instructors can clarify this for us....TIA
From the study material, as I understood it, controur trolling should end after using the first three sizes, yet...
while I attended the s/p course in Minaki, Ontario about 20 years ago I was surprised that in their specially prepared material and structure situations there was a few that called for contour trolling going as deep as necessary with the other size spoonplugs.
Perhaps one of the instructors can clarify this for us....TIA
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WMK
Gentlemen,
Our #1 instructor, Buck Perry, has provided us with specific direction regarding matters of "working deeper than the weedline & contour trolling, deep, in his Home Study Series. I'll refer you to Vol. 2 - Mapping & Interpretation. On page 16, figure-69, Buck presents the prospect of trolling deep breaklines and addresses it in specific terms in the answer section. Remember, breaks on a breakline need to be worked over with straight-line passes & casting, but entire breaklines, for practical purposes, can be covered by contour trolling.
In addition, there are several examples of working deeper than the weedline, in both instances of sharp breaking features and those having more gradual characteristics.
I would suggest a thorough review of Buck's "Series", starting with Presentation of Lures - Vol. 5 and continuing on until completing Vol. 8- Mental Aspects.
Walt
Our #1 instructor, Buck Perry, has provided us with specific direction regarding matters of "working deeper than the weedline & contour trolling, deep, in his Home Study Series. I'll refer you to Vol. 2 - Mapping & Interpretation. On page 16, figure-69, Buck presents the prospect of trolling deep breaklines and addresses it in specific terms in the answer section. Remember, breaks on a breakline need to be worked over with straight-line passes & casting, but entire breaklines, for practical purposes, can be covered by contour trolling.
In addition, there are several examples of working deeper than the weedline, in both instances of sharp breaking features and those having more gradual characteristics.
I would suggest a thorough review of Buck's "Series", starting with Presentation of Lures - Vol. 5 and continuing on until completing Vol. 8- Mental Aspects.
Walt
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John Bales
- JB2
- Posts: 2478
- Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:51 pm
Countour trolling VS straight line passes
We have the shallows, the deep and the inbetween waters. Learning how to troll the shallows is our first step in becoming a spoonplugger. This teaches us how to run lures. In our countour trolling of the shallows, (moving in and out GRADUALLY ) we learn to let the lures tell us what is there. We learn to interpret the bars that go out into the lake or reservoir. In many lakes and reservoirs by the time we get to the 250, we can already get a picture of what is there. This is where markers come into play (drop them on the fingers) and where the straight line passes will keep you out of trouble. Remember, the shallows is anything shallower than ten feet. In the early stages of your learning you should find a lake with little or no weeds so that you can learn how to run the first three sizes.
Now this brings us to the inbetween waters. The inbetween waters is where you will normally make contact with the fish. This water is also associated with breaklines that break more quickly, making it more difficult to keep lures in position. Where a sharper breakline exists that has many twists and turns, markers are a must in order to keep our lures in position.
Once we get past the inbetween waters(beyond the base breakline) the bottoms begin to flatten out(similar to what we had in the shallows) and now countour trolling is in order.
Where a weedline exists, we must stack our lures along the outside edge. It is not neccessary to run all 7 sizes in order to check out a deep weedline. Mr. Perry told me to pick a lure that runs about halfway down the weedline and that would cover it ok. If the weedline goes to 20 feet then start with a 250 or a 200 and that will check it fine. Then go to the base of the weedline. Again, this would be considered the inbetween waters and you will have twists and turns and sharper breaks so markers will be a must in this situation.
We talk a lot these days about fishing deeper. Our guidelines say that when we are not catching fish, we are not fishing deep enough. Eventually we must learn to fish in the deeper waters and know when and how. By no means go there untill you have learned how to troll the shallows and the inbetween waters. If you have not learned how to present lures in the shallows and use markers at the inbetween waters, then do not go any deeper untill you have spent a season or two doing so.
A fisherman cannot go to strange waters, view the weather and water conditions, look at a map of the lake and come up with where do I have the best chance to make a catch without spending some time on the water doing the right things.
We have a lot of spoonpluggers that are countour trollers. They rarely throw a marker and rarely get shoreline sightings. In many of our lakes where the northern pike and muskie exist, they catch enough fish that they are very happy with the results but they never get any better. Do not send them to a strange lake with only the bass because they will fail. They will fail because they never took the time to go by the guidelines. They never took the time to learn how to troll the shallows. For most of the time they are lost but still satisfied.
The best thing about spoonplugging is that there is no end to what we can learn about our fishing waters but in order to do so, we must use the tools and guidelines in our study material in order to get to the level that we want. John
Now this brings us to the inbetween waters. The inbetween waters is where you will normally make contact with the fish. This water is also associated with breaklines that break more quickly, making it more difficult to keep lures in position. Where a sharper breakline exists that has many twists and turns, markers are a must in order to keep our lures in position.
Once we get past the inbetween waters(beyond the base breakline) the bottoms begin to flatten out(similar to what we had in the shallows) and now countour trolling is in order.
Where a weedline exists, we must stack our lures along the outside edge. It is not neccessary to run all 7 sizes in order to check out a deep weedline. Mr. Perry told me to pick a lure that runs about halfway down the weedline and that would cover it ok. If the weedline goes to 20 feet then start with a 250 or a 200 and that will check it fine. Then go to the base of the weedline. Again, this would be considered the inbetween waters and you will have twists and turns and sharper breaks so markers will be a must in this situation.
We talk a lot these days about fishing deeper. Our guidelines say that when we are not catching fish, we are not fishing deep enough. Eventually we must learn to fish in the deeper waters and know when and how. By no means go there untill you have learned how to troll the shallows and the inbetween waters. If you have not learned how to present lures in the shallows and use markers at the inbetween waters, then do not go any deeper untill you have spent a season or two doing so.
A fisherman cannot go to strange waters, view the weather and water conditions, look at a map of the lake and come up with where do I have the best chance to make a catch without spending some time on the water doing the right things.
We have a lot of spoonpluggers that are countour trollers. They rarely throw a marker and rarely get shoreline sightings. In many of our lakes where the northern pike and muskie exist, they catch enough fish that they are very happy with the results but they never get any better. Do not send them to a strange lake with only the bass because they will fail. They will fail because they never took the time to go by the guidelines. They never took the time to learn how to troll the shallows. For most of the time they are lost but still satisfied.
The best thing about spoonplugging is that there is no end to what we can learn about our fishing waters but in order to do so, we must use the tools and guidelines in our study material in order to get to the level that we want. John